Friday, May 27, 2016

If ISIS aren't muslims, are they really atheists?

Grant that ISIS aren't really muslims. Grant that their motivations are not, at heart, religious at all - they are entirely secular. They are moved by desires for wealth, for housing, for jobs.

Alright. Carry that to its conclusion then - ISIS is a group of atheists, with secular motives. They're about as religious as a huckster televangelist saying God demanded donations. They do not kill for the glory of God - they want money, for the sake of comfort, and shelter, and food, and all the usual reasons.

I have a feeling that this will turn out to be wrong as well, but at that point ISIS becomes utterly mysterious, and we're left with the grim irony that their motivations cannot be attributed to natural forces.

But wait, that won't be accepted either...

It's amazing how complicated issues get when the most obvious and straightforward conclusions are declared impossible lest they offend regressive sensibilities.

6 comments:

B. Prokop said...

It's interesting how it seems every religion in the world other than Catholicism has only one way a person can be holy in this world. Or at the very least, everyone making an honest effort to follow their religion (again, other than in Catholicism) ends up looking pretty much the same. Thus, ISIS demands that all faithful Muslims behave in exactly the same way. As did the Puritans. As do the Mormons. Etc.

But take a look at the Catholic Saints. We have members of the clergy and laypeople. There are princes and popes, and farmers and day laborers. There are warriors and pacifists. There are the most learned people imaginable, and the illiterate. Cloistered nuns and worldly figures like JPII. It's why we have so many patron saints - because there is no occupation or way of life unrepresented.

Crude said...

I'm not so sure that applies to the hindus and buddhists. Then again, I only know so much.

B. Prokop said...

You are partially correct about the Hindi (whom I have studied extensively - I consider Hinduism to be the only worthy competitor to Catholicism), but even there, the various ways to holiness are hierarchical (some being "better" than others), whereas no one would dare say St. Thomas Aquinas was "worthier" than St. Terese of Lisieux, or St. Casimir worthier than St. Maria Goretti.

As to Buddhism, although I have dipped my toe into that ocean, I would be a fool to say I understand it.

Son of Ya'Kov said...

Well some might say ISIS are "Muslims" in the same way Hitler was "Catholic" that is only in the technical sense.

OTOH the problem with that comparison is Catholicism is the true religion and Islam is not. Catholicism has objective content and all of that content is true. Islam not so much.

Being that Islam like all heresies is a mixture of truth and error there are in fact different versions of this error that contain more truth then less. God (from a Catholic perspective) has written His Law on the hearts of Men and in so far that God might not give an efficacious grace for conversion to some Muslims God still gives graces to Muslims to interpret their religion in line with the natural law and in a beneficent manner.

The problem with saying ISIS doesn't practice true Islam is well technically there is no true Islam.

Like I said earlier in another argument. The Amish and the Mennonites have a beneficent religion but in the end it is still false in so far as it is not Catholicism.

ISIS dirt bags clearly go farther then professing their heresy. They obviously reject natural law as well witht their sick activities and sexual perversions and sex crimes. Thus they are not so much Atheist as they are godless.

Mr. Green said...

Son of Ya'Kov: Being that Islam like all heresies is a mixture of truth and error there are in fact different versions of this error that contain more truth then less. God (from a Catholic perspective) has written His Law on the hearts of Men and in so far that God might not give an efficacious grace for conversion to some Muslims God still gives graces to Muslims to interpret their religion in line with the natural law and in a beneficent manner.

Your recent posts make a lot of good points, but this is particularly well-put.

Son of Ya'Kov said...

So I am late in responding but thank Mr. Green.